TNEWS TALANOA

Jul 20, 2008 7:37 PM
The defence lawyers for four Tongan men found not guilty of murder want to know why New Zealand contributed aid to prosecute their clients.

The men were charged following the Tongan riots in November 2006 in which eight people died in a building belonging to the king.

A blazing inferno became a coffin for eight Tongans caught up in the rioting. Police later arrested four people who they claimed masterminded the attack on the building.

They were charged with murder and arson and the NZ government helped pay to have them prosecuted as part of an aid package.

"Should not give any money at all to anyone to prosecute," defence lawyer Nelesoni Tupou says.

New Zealand gave the Tongan government $137,000 to help prosecute riot-related offences but if the four men had been found guilty they faced a death sentence.

In 1990 New Zealand signed a United Nations-led protocol aimed at abolishing the death penalty.

"They are actually promoting is capital punishment which is against and contrary to the agreement they signed," says Tupou.

Foreign Minister Winston Peters said it would be inappropriate to comment on the judicial outcomes of another sovereign nation but he said the riots were a major upheaval for the kingdom and it was important prosecutions be brought where appropriate.

The defence team says while their clients have been found innocent, it has been a costly affair.

New Zealand has given another $70,000 to help pay lawyers' fees for the accused but Tupou says they have not received a cent.

ONE News understands the money has been paid to Tonga but a communication breakdown between the Tongan Law Society and Crown Law has meant no cash has been paid out to defence teams.

"I think New Zealand should come out and say to the defence teams in Tonga who are doing all these criminal trials - we will make good of the shortfall," Tupou says.

Source: http://tvnz.co.nz/view/page/536641/1921765

THREE HIGH-PROFILE Auckland lawyers are out of pocket by tens of thousands of dollars after the disappearance of a $70,000 New Zealand government grant towards defence costs in a Tongan murder trial.

Eb Leary, Charles Cato and Nalesoni Tupou spent months preparing for the trial of three Tongans jointly charged with arson and eight counts of murder after the November 2006 riots in the capital Nukualofa.

Tonga sought and was granted $170,000 from the New Zealand government towards the prosecution of the riot cases led by Auckland crown solicitor firm Meredith Connell and $70,000 towards the defence.

But the lawyers said none of them had received a cent for their efforts and they had been unable to trace where the $70,000 had gone.

"I have searched high and low in Tonga as to the funding for the defence, and all defence lawyers who were involved in this matter and other criminal trials as a result of the riot have not been paid from the fund," said Tupou.

One of the accused men was discharged before trial and the other two were acquitted last week. Had they been convicted, they could have faced the death penalty.

The lawyers said that because it was a capital case, the New Zealand government should not have helped to fund the prosecution and possibly send men to the gallows. Leary said the Australian government refused to assist because of the experience of the Bali 9, the young drug traffickers who were sentenced to death for heroin smuggling.

He said the months of preparation was worth hundreds of thousands of dollars, but the stakes were too high for the accused to leave them unrepresented.
Tupou tried repeatedly for more defence money but was told by Foreign Affairs Minister Winston Peters that the aid was always meant to be a contribution to defence costs and was not intended to cover them all.

Source: http://www.stuff.co.nz/sundaystartimes/4...a6442.html

Nelesoni,

My advice to you to recoup your money-

Bring youself, your wife, your children, your neighbours, your dog, your cat, your pig and your goat, and all of you- come and eat at the coronation to your heart is content.

When you leave, take with you the silverware, plates, table cloths and what ever unopened wine and beer you are able to carry with you. Consider putting saddle bags on the back of the goat to allow you to carry more. Only then, you may dome close to breaking even and get your money back.

Don't worry about the mess the animals leave behind, it will be hard to tell the difference between the excrement of the animals and that of the royal family themselves.

Ka pehe'i fau leva 'ae u'a pa'anga 'ae pule'anga pea tau fakatumutumu. Nalesoni 'oku mo'oni fau 'a Fakatafa, fa'o kihe lahi taha teke ala lavaa he 'oku ou tui au kuo kai 'ehe pule'angaa ia ho'omou $70,000. Mahalo koena ia 'oku kau atu ia he me'akai 'oku ha'u 'aki 'e g5 ki toilet. 'Ai ai moe 'ikai ke fihia ha konga me'akai he muii moe kaiha'a u'a pa'anga.

We need to first find out the facts before we start accusing anyone. I am sure the matter is being being investigated by the proper authorities and we will soon know the truth in due time.

The proper way is to let the proper authority carry out the investigations and prosecute those responsibled.

lcnnj Wrote:We need to first find out the facts before we start accusing anyone. I am sure the matter is being being investigated by the proper authorities and we will soon know the truth in due time.

The proper way is to let the proper authority carry out the investigations and prosecute those responsibled.

As if there is any "proper authorities" in the govt of Tonga!!! That is a swear word to g5 and sevali. hihihihihihihihihi Proper authorities = sh*t in Tonga.

lcnnj Wrote:We need to first find out the facts before we start accusing anyone. I am sure the matter is being being investigated by the proper authorities and we will soon know the truth in due time.

The proper way is to let the proper authority carry out the investigations and prosecute those responsibled.

Icnj,

An investigation has been conducted and the outcome is what Nelesoni has indicated. Its burried within the government.

So..what do you recommend he now? (Keep in mind this guy is a lawyer...and he's certainly not stupid!)

Kehekehe Wrote:

lcnnj Wrote:We need to first find out the facts before we start accusing anyone. I am sure the matter is being being investigated by the proper authorities and we will soon know the truth in due time.

The proper way is to let the proper authority carry out the investigations and prosecute those responsibled.

As if there is any "proper authorities" in the govt of Tonga!!! That is a swear word to g5 and sevali. hihihihihihihihihi Proper authorities = sh*t in Tonga.

I'm sure common sense will prevail or God help us all.....

Common sense, which sense??

fakatafa Wrote:

lcnnj Wrote:We need to first find out the facts before we start accusing anyone. I am sure the matter is being being investigated by the proper authorities and we will soon know the truth in due time.

The proper way is to let the proper authority carry out the investigations and prosecute those responsibled.

Icnj,

An investigation has been conducted and the outcome is what Nelesoni has indicated. Its burried within the government.

So..what do you recommend he now? (Keep in mind this guy is a lawyer...and he's certainly not stupid!)

He will do what all good Lawyers will do, prosecute those responsibled, and I noticed you were quick to condemned the government again. You are not being impartial and fair my friend, and I am disappointed with your kind of attitude. thankU

lcnnj Wrote:I'm sure common sense will prevail or God help us all.....

lcnnj, I can see blue smoke coming out from your behind. You seem defending and lack in reasoning. If youre running out of sense, you can retire to the falesi'i and fuel up b4 coming back. When did the govt of Tonga talks sense and have some sort of common sense? Bullsh*t! And when did the govt of Tonga have some "proper authorities"? That is another bullsh*t. Listen to wisdom! When Tonga started to talk respect, you'd know they're about to rip you off. When theyre started to talk religion then you know they're about to dig your heart out with a spoon and when they talk common sense then you know they're truly bullsh*t.

Icnnj
The government of Tonga has been spewing out lies left, right and center from all its orifices. You must be an over optimistic freak or simply blind to say there is proper authority in Tonga- the government.

With all the lies and corruptions, it is acceptable or common sense to condemn the government.

Fo'i'one'onena Wrote:

lcnnj Wrote:I'm sure common sense will prevail or God help us all.....

lcnnj, I can see blue smoke coming out from your behind. You seem defending and lack in reasoning. If youre running out of sense, you can retire to the falesi'i and fuel up b4 coming back. When did the govt of Tonga talks sense and have some sort of common sense? Bullsh*t! And when did the govt of Tonga have some "proper authorities"? That is another bullsh*t. Listen to wisdom! When Tonga started to talk respect, you'd know they're about to rip you off. When theyre started to talk religion then you know they're about to dig your heart out with a spoon and when they talk common sense then you know they're truly bullsh*t.

I am advocating impartiality and fair go,and the rule of law as you appear to be lopsided and full of hate for the government. This is a weakness in your character, and I suggest that you need to see a psychologist as this will get you into lots of strife.

You are quick to be personal and I find your approach very rude and and not called for, and do not appreciate people like you. I will not tell you in this forum of what I think of people like you, but hope that you will have a good day and be more careful and diplomatic in the future.

Icnnj,

the trouble want diplomacy which is ok, yet, i believe some of our folks are a upset is the abundance of diplomacy with lack of sound reasoning.

the facts remain:
70 thousand was sent to ministry of justice as a public defenders fund.
lawyers that are representing the accused public are not getting a cent

here is guess; i would not pass me that the minister of justice's husband received the fund.

Hala'ahanga Wrote:Icnnj
The government of Tonga has been spewing out lies left, right and center from all its orifices. You must be an over optimistic freak or simply blind to say there is proper authority in Tonga- the government.

With all the lies and corruptions, it is acceptable or common sense to condemn the government.

I think we need to give Icnnj the benefit of the doubt. He may legitimatley not know the recent and past instances of corruption of the Sevele administration.

He has proposed a democratic model. Despite what we (myself included) think, it is afterall his democractic right to put up such a proposal, and does not need to have the barrage of insults (myself included) of what this person thinks.

Let us attempt to win this person over to the "good side" by our patience and good works by explaining to him the reasons why we beleive what we believe, based on facts and historical precedents.

For example, our reasons for not believing the government to be honest in this case is that we have already experienced the scam of the minister of tourisms theft of donations from the Chinese government.

We also learned of the refusal by Sevele to follow the independant Attorney Generals recomendation to discipline the guilty minister Finasi. On this basis that the government (Sevele) is involved in the condoning and misappropriation of funds, we therefore believe that this case of a missing 70 thousand dollars has possibly suffered the same fate...the money is now in a minister's personal bank account.

fakatafa Wrote:

Hala'ahanga Wrote:Icnnj
The government of Tonga has been spewing out lies left, right and center from all its orifices. You must be an over optimistic freak or simply blind to say there is proper authority in Tonga- the government.

With all the lies and corruptions, it is acceptable or common sense to condemn the government.

I think we need to give Icnnj the benefit of the doubt. He may legitimatley not know the recent and past instances of corruption of the Sevele administration.

He has proposed a democratic model. Despite what we (myself included) think, it is afterall his democractic right to put up such a proposal, and does not need to have the barrage of insults (myself included) of what this person thinks.

Let us attempt to win this person over to the "good side" by our patience and good works by explaining to him the reasons why we beleive what we believe, based on facts and historical precedents.

For example, our reasons for not believing the government to be honest in this case is that we have already experienced the scam of the minister of tourisms theft of donations from the Chinese government.

We also learned of the refusal by Sevele to follow the independant Attorney Generals recomendation to discipline the guilty minister Finasi. On this basis that the government (Sevele) is involved in the condoning and misappropriation of funds, we therefore believe that this case of a missing 70 thousand dollars has possibly suffered the same fate...the money is now in a minister's personal bank account.

Let us focus on the one issue that we all agree on, and that is 'Democratic Reforms' to the government rather than our differences. We need to be constructive, truthful, diplomatic, and unbiased in our approach to our struggle. We are all on the same side(the People) and we need to send out the same message to the world.

We should also focus on the positives rather than the negatives and also less playing the 'blame game'. Viva Revolution!?? (only joking)

vavugirl Wrote:Icnnj,

the trouble want diplomacy which is ok, yet, i believe some of our folks are a upset is the abundance of diplomacy with lack of sound reasoning.

the facts remain:
70 thousand was sent to ministry of justice as a public defenders fund.
lawyers that are representing the accused public are not getting a cent

here is guess; i would not pass me that the minister of justice's husband received the fund.

The person/s responsibled for the misappropriation of this grant will soon be made public, and we should steer away from making any allegations until the truth is known.